Division 1 sectional seeds
99 – 1. Nick Barbaria (New Rochelle); 2. Kevin Rodriguez (Port Chester); 3. Jon Errico (Bryam Hills); 4. Brandon Fay (FL); 5. Alfredo Olmedo (Arlington); 6. Derek DiMarsico (North Rockland); 7. Jay Albis (John Jay-EF); 8. Tyler Gonska (Brewster); 9. Brian Hong (Clarkstown North); 10. James Kelly (Pearl River); 11. Matt Engert (Fox Lane); 12. Jordan Wallace (New Rochelle); 13. Joe Frezza (Mahopac); 14. Michael Carnevalle (Ossining); 15. Kevin Knox (Carmel); 16. John Wall (RC Ketcham).
106 – 1. Mike Parise (Brewster); 2. Blaise Benderoth (North Rockland); 3. Nick Tolli (Arlington); 4. Bryan Ferrandi (New Rochelle); 5. Mike DiNardo (Mahopac); 6. Alex Oliveto (Suffern); 7. Mike Seligson (Clarkstown North); 8. Alex Notaro (Clarkstown South); 9. Nick Engert (Fox Lane); 10. Manny Pragana (John Jay-EF); 11. Jack Wagner (Hen Hud); 12. Paul Caruso (Mahopac); 13. Alec Beresin (John Jay); 14. Scott Rodrigues (Fox Lane); 15. Robert Keltz (Scarsdale); 16. Eddie Tomaskovic (Carmel).
113 – 1. Troy Feniger (North Rockland); 2. Dylan Realbuto (Somers); 3. Alex Delacruz (Ossining); 4. John Muldoon (Pearl River); 5. Jon Alvarez (East Ramapo); 6. Zack Boker (Mahopac); 7. Travis Becker (Arlington); 8. Brian McLiverity (Clarkstown South); 9. Frank Surace (Fox Lane); 10. Mike Hodges (Scarsdale); 11. Dean Guevarra (Clarkstown North); 12. Kirby Atlas (Horace Greeley); 13. Mark Grant (Hen Hud); 14. Dominic Testa (John Jay-EF); 15. Warren Gabrillo (Fox Lane); 16. Max Valera (Mamaroneck).
120 – 1. Liam Erickson (Brewster); 2. Mark Settembrino (RC Ketcham); 3. Adit Thakur (Nyack); 4. Jake DiMarsico (North Rockland); 5. Jimmy Kaishian (Yorktown); 6. Ben Ettlinger (Fox Lane); 7. Joe Maida (Harrison); 8. Derrick Feliciano (Arlington); 9. Diego Giron (Port Chester); 10. Jose Rodriguez (North Rockland); 11. Dan Ferriera (Lakeland/Panas); 12. Rameek McKenzie (Yonkers); 13. Steve Richardson (Hen Hud); 14. Bing Bing Xie (Horace Greeley); 15. Sergei Meyer (Tappan Zee); 16. Pat Hogan (Pearl River).
126 – 1. Sam Speno (Fox Lane); 2. Matt Caputo (North Rockland); 3. Gavin Menchel (Harrison); 4. Tommy Gonska (Brewster); 5. Josh Simpfenderfer (RC Ketcham); 6. Danny Murphy (RC Ketcham); 7. Jon Russo (Horace Greeley); 8. Juan Pablo Loja (Sleepy Hollow); 9. Alec Lambiotte (John Jay); 10. Carlos Aponte (Tappan Zee); 11. Mike Camastro (Mahopac); 12. Daniel Jureller (Scarsdale); 13. Austin Fox (Clarkstown South); 14. Brandon Badger (Arlington); 15. Santiago Forero (New Rochelle); 16. Alex Graap (Somers).
132 – 1. Danny Ventura (Fox Lane); 2. Mike Morabito (RC Ketcham); 3. John Tambunting (Scarsdale); 4. Colby Kash (Clarkstown North); 5. Edwin Jiminez (Sleepy Hollow); 6. Kevin McDermott (Hen Hud); 7. Max Gomez (New Rochelle); 8. Jimmy Duncan (Brewster); 9. Kyle Santucci (Yorktown); 10. Luke Minasi (John Jay-EF); 11. Kyle Turchick (Somers); 12. David Polakoff (Harrison); 13. Mitchell Klein (Horace Greeley); 14. Vinny Martin (Arlington); 15. Fred Saintil (Mount Vernon); 16. Dan Walsh (Mahopac).
138 – 1. Jake Srednicki (Mahopac); 2. Tom Grippi (Fox Lane); 3. Charlie Garcia (Tappan Zee); 4. Christian Wassweiler (Beacon); 5. Joe Koshakow (Scarsdale); 6. Max Bachmeier (Mahopac); 7. James Desimone (Suffern); 8. Larry Courtien (Somers); 9. Dan DeStefano (Suffern); 10. Steve Moreno (Pearl River); 11. Mike D’Agostino (North Rockland); 12. Max Lukaswitz (Harrison); 13. Adam Meyer (Scarsdale); 14. Ari Faust (Fox Lane); 15. Reid Orlando (Clarkstown South); 16. Kessler Felix (Nyack).
145 – 1. Joe Mastro (Yorktown); 2. Mike Caputo (North Rockland); 3. Dale White (John Jay-EF); 4. Josh Perlmutter (Hen Hud); 5. Ryan Becker (Clarkstown North); 6. Giancarlo Morreale (Fox Lane); 7. Chris Pecora (Carmel); 8. James Laurent (New Rochelle); 9. Liam Gallagher (Clarkstown South); 10. Ibrahim Simreen (Yonkers); 11. Andrew Artrip (Suffern); 12. Kevin Ortiz (Sleepy Hollow); 13. Chen Shen (Scarsdale); 14. Jeff Dempsey (Rye); 15. Liam Heine (Somers); 16. Luka Pavicic (Mamaroneck).
152 – 1. Brian Realbuto (Somers); 2. Ben Miller (Mamaroneck); 3. Kyle McAlpin (Brewster); 4. Brad Marvin (RC Ketcham); 5. Desmond Djekovic (Tappan Zee); 6. Nick Didio (North Rockland); 7. Aaron Johnson (John Jay-EF); 8. Lance Perlmutter (Hen Hud); 9. Andrew Sion (Brewster); 10. Mark Lasar (Somers); 11. Justin Karas (Port Chester); 12. Brian Hackel (Scarsdale); 13. Tom Jensen (White Plains); 14. Jean-Paul Ospina (Sleepy Hollow); 15. Demetrius Rodrigues (New Rochelle).
160 – 1. Matt Pasqualini (Fox Lane); 2. Phil Siegel (Hen Hud); 3. Nick Giella (Suffern); 4. Dion Duran (Mamaroneck); 5. Devante Harrell (Ossining); 6. Anthony Scott (Arlington); 7. Gabe Palacios (Sleepy Hollow); 8. Aaron Gallagher (Mahopac); 9. Jonathan Leman (John Jay-EF); 10. Jacob Lynch (New Rochelle); 11. Daniel Poggoli (New Rochelle); 12. Chris Flynn (Pearl River); 13. Michael Peterson (Arlington); 14. Carlos Seminaro (White Plains); 15. Dylan Salamone (Mahopac); 16. DJ Dross (Beacon).
170 – 1. Aaron Butler (New Rochelle); 2. Jack Braun (Scarsdale); 3. Brenden Nunziata (Arlington); 4. Declan Myer (John Jay); 5. Steven Sabella (Yorktown); 6. Harry Erickson (Brewster); 7. Brett Perry (John Jay-EF); 8. Joe Simolocaj (Rye); 9. Valdon Djekovic (Tappan Zee); 10. Matt Oliva (Clarkstown South); 11. Angelo Revel (Somers); 12. Dennis Carroll (Tappan Zee); 13. Bryant Quichiz (Suffern); 14. Chris Manjuck (Fox Lane); 15. Brock Cvijanovich (Horace Greeley); 16. Kurt Schwarz (New Rochelle).
182 – 1. Jacob Berkowitz (Scarsdale); 2. Bruno Albertassi (Brewster); 3. Thomas Murray (Yorktown); 4. Ryan Boyle (North Rockland); 5. Michael Amato (Beacon); 6. Mike Rosenthal (John Jay); 7. Tome Marku (Clarkstown South); 8. Jonathan Stokes (New Rochelle); 9. Jason DiBenedetto (Somers); 10. AJ Alvarez (Carmel); 11. Billy Gossett (John Jay); 12. Beni Sinanaj (Tappan Zee); 13. Robert Hanaburgh (Arlington); 14. Michael Rodriguez (Suffern).
195 – 1. Mike Spinelli (Mahopac); 2. Deondre Pierce (Beacon); 3. Scott Wymbs (Horace Greeley); 4. Paul Okeke (Clarkstown South); 5. Matt Day (Arlington); 6. Ekpenede Imasuen (North Rockland); 7. Nick Giancaspro (Somers); 8. Trent Lofaro (Ossining); 9. Brian Gunderson (Byram Hills); 10. John Hartnett (Tappan Zee); 11. Murphy Wilson (RC Ketcham); 12. Tyrick Jackson (Suffern); 13. Wilmer Quintero-Martinez (Clarkstown South); 14. Trenton Floyd (John Jay); 15. TJ Lyons (John Jay-EF): 16. Max McMullen (Harrison).
220 – 1. Dom DeVita (Somers); 2. Tyler Lilly (New Rochelle); 3. Dan Clune (Fox Lane); 4. Chris McGann (Tappan Zee); 5. Jason Dorsainville (East Ramapo): 6. Bryan Burger (Suffern); 7. AJ Cesarini (Eastchester); 8. Steven O’Connell (Byram Hills): 9. Ethan Smith (John Jay); 10. Billy Marino (Horace Greeley); 11. Christian Zamano (Port Chester); 12. Matt Pascoe (RC Ketcham); 13. Tyler Otero (Mahopac); 14. Matt St. Onge (Clarkstown South).
285 – 1. Sean Barry (Hen Hud); 2. David Varian (Yorktown); 3. Michael Manni (Tappan Zee); 4. Brent Lobien (Horace Greeley); 5. Frank Curnaj (Sleepy Hollow); 6. Charles Francois (Nyack); 7. Tyler Vanderlinde (RC Ketcham); 8. Justin Douglas (New Rochelle); 9. Nick Holahan (Clarkstown South); 10. Andriy Lypchuk (Fox Lane); 11. Louis Talia (John Jay); 12. Conner Reigotti (North Rockland); 13. Anthony Campanelli (Somers); 14. Terry Hairston (Yonkers); 15. Clifford Joseph (Suffern).
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they went only off of competition points and screwed alot of kids.
how is feniger seeded ahead of delacruz and realbuto? if that stays that way, after head to heads, someone is getting screwed over there.
This proves what a joke NY wrestling really is. How is this possible…...... Is this just section one or all NY. You have instances where kids have won 2x’s over the 1 seed. Lots of finals will be a F———-C joke.
Dale White pinned Joe Mastro and will get pinned by either Caputo or White in the finals. The real finals match will happen in the semis.
SAD day for wretling the adults once again screwed thing royally.
This will kill any chances for wildcards for the kids that deserve it. Where did this come from and how did it pass. Cannot be true..
All I have to say is WOW. Vince , can we get the paper work posted that led to these seedings and the rules associated with them?
This just doesn’t seem right
113, 145 are only weight that look off. Both semis are prob better matches. Having to face a kid a rd early isnt a big difference you still have to beat that kid to win. But is muldoon vs realbuto. And mastro vs white/caputo really that horrible of matches??
We need to be heard, this cannot stand. What has happened to common sense. If your team wrestles a weak schedule, which many do in Section1, doesnt matter if you beat the kid a couple oF times, why would that matter. WHAT A COMPLETE JOKE, THEY RUINED THE TOURNEY.
182 is screwed up royally as well alvarez is 10th seed and beat the 2nd 5th 6th and 9th seed?? this really is a joke this year. and sadly its all politics and this is screwing kids who worked the butts off all year for this tournament.
Lets be honest 182 doesn’t matter.
But this is really is just wrong. Old Coach is right, It is taking away chances for some of the best kids in the section to get wildcards.
These seeds are the same as last couple of years. Points based on win-loss differential, caliber of competition points and prior sectional/state placing. Basically the only head to head comes in when a 4th seed beat 3rd, 3rd over 2nd or 2nd over 1st. Very similar to state seeding. There is no arguing or coaches maneuvering.
Can someone please explain why “they ruined” the tourney or this is a joke?
Just tell me how troy fenniger is seeded over delacruz and realbuto and muldoon they all beat him . Must be a misprint. White and caputo in semis ,please this is a joke u know and all will know it.
How are they affected by the wild card? The 3rd seed can get a wild card without being affected by the 2nd place guy unless he lost to 2nd place guy. Same seeding has been used the last few years in d1 and d2. No one complained about d2 seeds this yr.
Vince,
Any chance you can get us the seeding criteria so we can put this to bed?
i dont even see how feniger is seeded ahead of delacruz, let alone realbuto, the 1st criteria of the points is win percentage, feniger won 32/41 matches, so the points from that alone is 78, and then delacruz won 31 of 35, so he gets 86 points, and the second criteria, prestige points, according to where you placed last year, delacruz would have more points because he took 3rd in the section last yr, while feniger only took 4th. then you add in quality of competition, which points are’nt even that high unless you start beating section champs and all state kids, and those points definitely aren’t enough to beat delacruz’s total. something fishy going on here.
wild cards,
No one complained because the D2 seeds fell were everyone thought they would. These did not.
criteria goes like this: win percentage*100 + prestige points according to section/state finish from previous year + quality of competition points (points for beating kids according to where they placed the previous year and points for losing to kids under same criteria, but losing doesn’t get you nearly as many points.)
How is Feniger first? Realbuto took 2nd in the state and he lost to Delacruz and lost to Muldoon twice! That is a messed up bracket!!!
if head to head is not the first criteria, why not just pick out of a hat. Many kids work hard and this is the system they use. New Jersey’s system puts this to shame.
Finager beat a kid 3rd in state, beat 2 section champ, and 4 all section kids. All about pts people.
So Feniger and Muldoon each get pinned by Trey twice and get points for that?
What would happen if brian realbuto lost a match due to a slam. Would that kid go #1. No of course not, but Thats the way things used to be before the pts.
REALBUTO 1 ST IN SECTION 2ND IN STATE 2ND IN EASTERN STAES. fENNIGER 2ND IN ROCKLAND.. joke>>>>>>>>>
SEEDING POINTS AND CRITERIA
Criterion # 1 – Record
Percentage record of this season’s Varsity dual meet and tournament bouts; based on
total won/lost record.
Total wins divided by total bouts (Always round out to two decimal points)
Example: 15 – 5 15 divided by 20 = 75.00
Example: 12 – 5 12 divided by 17 = 70.59
You must have 12 bouts minimum to get full total. If not, subtract 8 points for each
bout under 12 from the total.
Example: 6 – 2 Record
6 divided by 8 = 75.00 – 32 (4 bouts short of 12 X 8pts) = 43.00
Criterion #2 – Prestige
Award bonus points for this wrestler’s accomplishments in last years Section Qualifier
(Divisional), State Qualifier (Sectionals), and State Tournament. Only the highest
point value will be awarded, not a combination of all place finishes.
State Champion = 150
State – 2nd Place = 130
State – 3rd Place = 120
State – 4th Place = 110
State – 5th Place = 105
State – 6th Place = 100
Section Champion = 65
Section – 2nd Place = 50
Section – 3rd Place = 30
Section – 4th Place = 25
Section – 5th Place = 20
Section – 6th Place = 15
Division Champion = 10
Criterion #3 – Caliber of Competition
Bonus points are awarded for competing against the best competition during this year’s dual
meets and tournament bouts. Only the highest point total per unique wrestler will be awarded.
If a wrestler wrestles a state, section or division place finisher more than one time, that
wrestler will be awarded the highest points for each bout wrestled (i.e. If a wrestler
wrestles a section champion 3 times, wins twice and looses once, that wrestle would get 30
30 4 = 64 Caliber Points.
Win Against Large = Large School vs Large School / Small School vs Large School
Win Against Small = Large School vs Small / Small School vs Small School
Loss Against Large = Large School vs Large School / Small School vs Large School
Win Against Small = Large School vs Small / Small School vs Small School
ELIMINATION OF WINS AND LOSSES VS OUT OF STATE AND PRIVATE SCHOOLS
**LARGE SCHOOL (only) – an additional 15 points will be awarded to Divisional Champions at
the conclusion of the 2012 Divisional Tournament (for section seeding purposes only).
HEAD TO HEAD CRITERIA:
Head to Head – A split (1 win and 1 loss against the same opponent – last win
has leverage). A win advantage by one of the wrestlers could get that wrestler
with head to head wins a higher seed. At the Sectional Tournaments, the Head
to Head Criteria will be considered.
Large Schools – Coaches will have an opportunity to review each weight class
allowing for challenges 1-4 seeds for the Divisionals and 1-8 seeds for the
Sectionals to see if seeded appropriately or to apply head-to-head criteria.
Head to Head
1. A wrestler will move up one spot if he has a head to head win over the
individual immediately ahead of him, e.g. 4 seed defeats 3, 3 seed defeats 2,
2 seed defeats 1.
2. Head to head consideration will occur working down in this order: 2 seed vs.
1, 3 seed vs. 2, 4 seed vs. 3.
3. Wrestlers are not reordered if head to head did occur and step #3 is
repeated if necessary.
Section1,
Do not make this a personal attack against any wrestler. He didn’t make the rules he just went out on the mat and wrestled. He is sitting where he is because he doesn’t suck.
PRC E8
Your the best.
Let’s tell Eric Romanino to call off the tournament, because it’s all screwed up! I thought you have to beat everyone to be a champ? Am I wrong. There is a clear cut criteria that is followed. If it doesn’t fit every circumstance, then the people affected will have to suck it up and actually wrestle! This sport teaches people how to deal adversity not cry when things dont go their way. Pull up your skirts and wrestle!
What do you guys think the results will be for the 99 weight?
Maybe realbuto should have wrestled tre during their dual instead of not wrestling because they are workout partners. Realbuto wins he is 1 seed.
Wrestling1
Great. Your right. Does that make you feel better?
Grow the f*** up and leave kids names out of it. If not don’t hide behind a screen name
I think overall 99 seeding is correct…
How do you think dimarsico would do?
Barbaria clear cut champ. Who cares who is second?
Guys,
I had a feeling that there would be this type of reaction, so let me go over a few things.
The points system is based on previous placings, quality wins based on competition, and winning percentage. In the event that a wrestler is ranked DIRECTLY below someone who he has beaten, they swap. But a wrestler cannot jump up more than one spot based on a head-to-head win.
There are a few weight classes that surprised me, most notably 113 (145 and 182 also come to mind). I believe the top two guys in that weight class are seeded two and three, which could jeopardize one’s chances of making states. But remember, a guy who places third can be selected as a wild card for states, but it may decrease his chances.
I have spoken with a reliable source who was in the meeting, and I was assured that all of these point totals were double-checked specifically because they felt that a few seeds would generate this type of response. I know these rumors of foul play are sexy, but I don’t think that was the case here.
The bottom line is that, even if they know that Wrestler A is better than Wrestler B, if there is no head-to-head (as is the case with Realbuto and Feniger), they have to stick to points system. I believe it could be tweaked, but it certainly works more often than not. The main thing is that it’s very difficult to bring opinions about who is better than who into this, even if it certain cases it would make everyone happier.
There are several cases where I believe that a wrestler who is ranked sixth or seventh deserves to be more like fourth or fifth, but that’s the nature of this type of thing. I know a lot of you like to talk about proving it on the mat, and if a guy deserves a section title, I believe he’ll get it done no matter where he is seeded.
While I understand the gripes, let’s try not to get too negative here. This should be a very exciting weekend of wrestling; one I know we’re all looking forward to. Questions and comments are fine, and I’ll be happy to answer as many as I can in tomorrow night’s chat.
From looking at this its not the kids fault he beat quality kids! On the other hand it does suck for Delacruz and Realbuto think about this Realbuto has to weigh in Sunday morning and then go wrestle Delacruz first match I see Delacruz over Realbuto in semi’s and over Muldoon in finals.
Why does weighing in on Sunday have anything to do with it?
Sect1fan
I agree good thinking bro
Section 1 rules and regs…...www.swboces.org/files/filesystem/wrestling 2011-12.pdf
Wrestling1
You are the best
Grappling
Cause you can eat and if you don’t digest or eat a little too much you don’t have that bad match against a lower wrestler like realbuto an Delacruz that’s a section finals match in the semis and he can wrestle bad and give up their title. Who ever the finals are at 113 the winner will be the winner of Delacruz vs. realbuto
I say it again,, this tournament is a JOKE. Kids are penalized because coaches are afraid to wrestle tough schedules. Dale white 2nd eastern state, Caputo 3rd.
When realbuto faces de la cruz he will have made weight only an hr before. If cutting alot of weight your not at 100% in an hr. If it was in the finals he would probably be 5 lbs heavier and be at 100%
Old coach
Your awesome
Sam Speno State Champion
Harder match right away after sucking out….not as much time to recoup before tuff match, where as if had him in finals he cud rest/eat all day and go into the match refreshed and weighing in excess of 120…..old days used to be no second day weigh in..lweighed out end of day 1
Section1…you have some set on you! How can you say a high school kid who’s qualified to wrestle in the sections sucks?? That is one of the most asinine comments ever. Troy is a high caliber wrestler and one of the nicest kids around. Good luck to all the young men for making this far!!
If the criteria goes by points, in 113- Realbuto has most points – according to NWCA he has 186 to Feniger 161. Also in 106, Mike Seligson is over Alex Notoro? Seligson didn’t even place in the top four of Divisions, and has lost at least 3 times this year to Notoro.
Also, why does last year place have anything to do with this year. So many kids are at completely different weight classes- what bearing does last year have on how a kid wrestled this year?
Snap down
It’s not hard to make it to sections at all or place at sections
Nice kid average wrestler. No wonder why kids do not go out for wrestling anymore. Adults are assholes , look at the seeds, this is fair..please get REAL”“”“””
Why have Divisions means nothing at all. So many match ups where kids have destroyed other kds only to be seeded lower.
Please, you adults are way to into this… This sport isnt enjoyable when the parents intervine. You can complain all you want but nothing will be fixed. You need to start acting like adults, because you all seem like crying litle children. Stop worrying about your kid and let him wrestle, and PROVE himself worthy of a section title. I love proving the seeds wrong as a wrestler placing higher then what I am. I dont need a parent to complain for me. Do it on the mat.
Feniger:
Record:
(32/41)*100=78
Prestige:
4th in 2011 Section One Championships: 25
Caliber of Competition:
Agoney, Kyler | Peru Sr HS | 113 | W | MD |10 – 1(Section 7 CHAMP: 30pts)
Stramiello, John | Pine Bush Sr HS | 113 | L | DEC | 6 – 8 (Section 9 CHAMP: 3pts)
Oliveto, Alex | Suffern Sr HS | 113 | W | DEC | 7 – 5(6th Section 1: 15pts)
Aslanian, JohnEdgemont Sr High School 113 L FALL 1:33 (2nd NYS: 5pts)
Aslanian, JohnEdgemont Sr High School 113 L FALL 4:45 (2nd NYS: 5pts)
Curatolo, Santo |Tottenville-PSAL | 113| W| DEC | 12 – 10 | (PSAL CHAMP: 50pts)
stowell, dillon |Gouverneur Sr HS | 113 | W | DEC| 6 – 4 | (3rd NYS: 90pts)
Cook, Laken | Ilion Sr HS| 113 | L | DEC | 2 – 9 | (5th NYS: 4pts)
Lapi, Brandon | Amsterdam High School | 113 | L| DEC | 0 – 6 | (3rd NYS: 4pts)
Guevarra, Dean | Clarkstown North Sr HS | 113 | W | DEC | 9 – 5 | (5th Section 1: 20pts)
NET TOTAL: 329pts
Super,
Any idea what Dylan’s points look like?
Realbuto:
Record:
(36/38)*100= 94pts
Prestige:
2nd NYSPHSAA Championships: 130pts
Caliber of Competion:
ETTLINGER, BENFox Lane High School 120 W MD 17 – 6 (Section 1 6th: 15pts)
ETTLINGER, BENFox Lane High School 120 W DEC 4 – 1 (Section 1 6th: 15pts)
Delacruz, AlexOssining Sr High School 113 W DEC 8 – 6 (Section 1 3rd: 35pts)
Raghunandan, Mark Long Beach Sr High School 113 L DEC 6 – 7 (2nd NYS: 5pts)
NET TOTAL: 294pts
Please correct me if I made any mistakes, I’m about to do 145 to clear up the seeding there.
Super,
Much appreciated. Last question. Was deLacruz or muldoon even close?
Muldoon, no, his schedule was not rigorous enough to draw enough bonus points. Delacruz could come within 50 or so points of Realbuto, but he didn’t have any significant bonus points like Realbuto’s 2nd place finish at states or Fenigers wins over Curatolo, Stowell, and Agoney.
Did D Realbuto loss all of his points from Eastern States due to the DQ? I don’t see those points in his points list.
None of the kids he beat at Eastern States placed in their respective sections last year. (except Delacruz)
1st our class A football champs play 3 games in 11 days and now this. We may have the highest priced educators in the nation..certainly not the smartest.
its the entire state on this system, and im assuming other states as well
this explains why Feniger was the 1 seed at divisonals too, didn’t realize the schedule he had wrestled
just saying in the good old days 1st plays finishers from divisionals, seeded 1-4, 2nd place 5-8 and so on…..
Feniger 5th may be a little low but not as bad as the way it turned out
however the talk of someone getting screwed out of a wildcard ? well there was a day when there wasnt a wildcard and someone got a bye at states, so lucky to have it anyway
This is the system in use so we have to live with it no system is perfect! However a example were it could screw a kid is again at 113 If Realbuto beats Delacruz and lets say Feniger get’s o finals and losses to Realbuto so it goes Champ- Realbuto, Feniger- 2nd, and Delacruz 3rd place Feniger could get wildcard over Delacruz who has beaten Feniger! Get rid of Divisional if you take no head to head from divisionals into consideration for Sectional Seeding.
Another upset I see 126- Camastro from Mahopac knocks off Murphy-RCk first round then knocks of Menchel-Harrison to get to the finals.
excuse me beating Menchel would put him in Semi Finals
Sect1fan, you have no clue How wild card works. Finager wouldnt block delacruz from getting a wild card. If 3rd never lost to 2nd he os fine. even If it was seeded the way u wanted, If fineger took 3rd and delacruz 2nd, fineger might jump him with his win over stowell 3rd nys. Delacruz was 3rd in sec last yr, Troy 4th. Not a big difference.
sect 1 fan, i agree with camastro winning first two matches, but that leaves him in semis vs caputo not finals.
Does anyone know the process/criteria for choosing the wrestlers that will receive wild cards (once the section has already been told the number of wild cards it has been alotted)?
FYI, another seeding anomaly I noticed … Minasi is seeded 10th at 132. He has beaten the 2nd seed twice (once by pin and once by major decision), and the only Section 1 wrestler he’s lost to this season is the #1 seed. Along the lines of the comment made by “A Seeded Wrestler”, I’m guessing Minasi will place 2nd at sectionals by doing his talking “on the mat”. While the seeding formula may be imperfect, at least it’s objective. As already stated by a few, there is no perfect system.
Looking forward to another exciting sectionals. Best of luck to all the wresters!
How does Sabella end up number 5 seed beat Braun and Annuziato head 2 head,
I have followed sec1 for years and these seeds are pure HORSEHOCKEY, A GENUINE CLUSTER FOCK!!
113. #1 FENINGER? Why did Della Cruz both to beat him divisional? I could go on but why bother. ERIC, YOU WOULD HAVE BEEN BETTER OFF PICKING OUT OF A FRIGGING HAT!!!!!!!!
145…Castro ahead of Caputo and White. Caputo ahead of White…LAUGHABLE!!
fls1fan… Here is the criteria for deciding wildcards.
Wildcard applicants will earn points in three ways:
1-Current season: Difference between wins and losses
2-Bonus Points based on prior year Sectional and State place finishes.
3-Power points based on the past 6 year history of how many place-winners
your Section has had at the NYS tournament. The Power point scale will be
adjusted on an annual basis to always reflect the most recent six years.
Top 4 Sections: Earn +10, Middle 4: +5, Bottom 4: do not earn any.
The wildcard applicants can only be 2nd and 3rd place winners at sections.
To quote the tourney director of the Eastern States many years ago, “the seeding committee tried to screw every team evenly!” He then went on to explain that no system is perfect and the major goal of the seed was to separate the 8 best wrestlers in the top 8 seeds. Looking at our section brackets I think we can be happy if the top 4 are separated. A 1 or 2 seed really is the same thing, where 3 and 4 lie could cause some great semis which may end up being better bouts than the finals. Basically the champs will rise to the ocassion and beat the guys they have to when they meet. I am not crazy about some of the seeds my wrestlers got but I am moving forward and preparing them for their first round opponents. Good luck to all and welcome to South on Saturday!
Coach Rogers
FYI… for the first criteria the max points a wreslter can be awarded is 45pts.
4-(Beginning with 2010-11)Competiton Points: 6 pts for defeating a State
Champ, 5 points for a runner up, 4 pts for 3rd, 3 pts for 4th, 2 pts for 5th, 1
pt for 6th. Wrestlers earn the points every time they beat a placewinner.
Troy has 363.05 points and Realbuto has 324.74 and delacruz has 242.57 points.
Additionally, all the wrestlers are organized by points. Then the top 6 are adjusted to satisfy head to head.
snap down, thanks for the info!
That means it’s theoretically possible to lose in the sectional semis and still be selected as a wild card (if you win the 3rd place match and have enough wild card points).
It also seems to mean that wrestling lots of matches within the season is key, in order to get as close as possible to the 45-point maximum (won-lost differential).
As a coach you need to plan out the season for each kid to get them the available points out their at tournaments cause most of your dual meets are already done through BOCES. But when you go to dual meets or dual meet tournaments and wrestlers with a point value bump away from your kid their is nothing you can do, it’s just lost out points.
They need to be able to take the top 4 or 6 seeds and match up head to head no matter if they are 6th seed or 3rd seed and allow them to jump up to that wrestler they beat seeded a head of them. They can’t really do this 1-16 or we end up back where it took an hour to seed one weight class. But not to be able to bump over a guy you beat during the season that because there is a wrestle between you and him is bad for the sport, cause isn’t it about beating your opponent. Also getting points for beating a guy over and over and over during the year needs to change some how.
The system is better then what is was but still needs to tweak it to be fair to all.
I complete mockery, call it like it is.There is noway a kid beats a kid twice and should be seeded lower. The hell with points what about who beats who . JOKE
Trust me, I have that situation at 99, 132, 145, 170 it really only matters on the points, not fair to the kids that bust their A$$ all season/year long to go out and win and not be rewarded for it.
1ST. CRITERIA HEAD TO HEAD . After that the adults with there complicated computer programs can take over. Look at New Jersey , they actually use common sense, this system would be laughed at.
Its the same system thats been used for last 3 years, some coaches have realized they need to go out and find out of section quality kids, while other have wrestled the same tournament schedule for the last 10 yrs. If you host your own tournament, invite tougher teams. Why is it that since we went to pt system section 1 has had one of Its best 3 year stretch at states ever? Pts promote wrestling good kids, wrestling good kids gets you more ready for state level.
Old skool
I do know how the wild card works and looking at Fenigers points he would have more points towards a wildcard then Delacruz! Either way will be interesting sectional tournament biggest upset Delacruz over Realbuto Sunday morning!
looks like you Dont, lol. Sectional seeding pts and wildcard points are totally different. The pts listed on the blog is sectional seeding. State wildcard selection is completly different. I believe the wildcard info is on longisland website.
Plus i think muldoon beat fineger in semis and delacruz and fineger will be wrestling for a wildcard spot in the 3/4 match
170…OH NO…I THINK I $HIT MYSELF!!! THIS WT CLASS SEEDING IS REALLY A MESS.
Hopefully the ‘powers that be’ will decide at some point to tweak the system. Some obvious week spots are:
1. 50 points for defeating a PSAL champ??? Wow!
2.Only getting 1.4 times the number of points (130) for actually placing 2nd at the state tournament than someone who beats a 3rd place finisher (90) when it doesn’t count at some dual or mid season tourney. Anyone can win a single match. The better wrestler could be sick, injured or simply off that day. That is totally different them stringing 4 great matches, all against studs, on the big stage in Albany!
3. There should be no points if you are defeated with bonus points (i.e. major, tech and definitely not by pin). Hey, I think I could get pinned by Jordan Burroughs without even trying! How many points should I get for that?
4. Getting 20 points for defeating a 5th place finisher in a section which is only 10 less then what you get for defeating a section champ.
5. Not getting points for winning or placing high in a tournament that had studs in the field that you did not wrestle and who finished lower.
6. Not weighting D1 vs. D2 opponents (if they don’t – not sure). Not that there are not great wrestlers in D2 but the significantly lower number of schools make it so much easier to place.
Oh, and I second the sentiment of making the issue about the system and not the kids!
Good luck to all Section 1 wrestlers!!
Jap, Your first 2 points are valid, but what if the win against 3rd in state was at easterns??
Rest of your points arent. If i lose to a 4th place guy in d1 I get 2 pts, i actually lose pts by wrestling him than getting on my butt and not wrestling that day.
You recieve no points for regular season tournament places
Jap, Your first 2 points are valid, but what if the win against 3rd in state was at easterns??
Rest of your points arent. If i lose to a 4th place guy in d1 I get 2 pts, i actually lose pts by wrestling him than sitting on my butt and not wrestling that day.
Beating a sec champ is worth 50 pts. beating a 5th is worth 20
You recieve no points for regular season tournament places. So placing high above other kids means nothing.
There is a difference in points between beating d1 and d2 kids
If your not 100% sure on exact details, Dont come on here making up false numbers to get people more fired up.
I believe some of the seeds may have math errors, and when noted these seeds should be re-seeded or corrected. Up to what time can one challenge the math. I think this is a valid point and one should check – if you think it makes a diff.
Math was correct for every kid, their coach did the math, then was reviewed by 5 coaches for each weight class. Everything is set in stone. No appeals
D1 and D2 are different points at the section level but not the state level i think, not 100% on that
biggest thing as mentioned before the head-to-head needs to be extended, if the seeds had been any other way but Feniger 1st they would have worked out, but without Realbuto wrestling him it got stuck. them being in line im guessing is just to try and clear up and scenario’s where A beat B, B beat C, and C beat A. But they could just say in those scenario’s you go based by points. But Realbuto beat Delacruz, Delacruz beat Feniger, Muldoon beat Feniger twice (within the section who did Feniger beat?) you put him ahead of anyone but Dylan who he didnt wrestle and he falls back to fourth. Delacruz’s only loss to a Sec 1 113lber is Dylan, Muldoon’s only D1 Section 1 loss is Dylan, him and Delacruz havent wrestled so they go points
its not that complicated, head-to-heads get expanded if you run into a A,B,C scenario you ignore the head-to-heads and go just points
as for beating state place finishers maybe you get too many points for that, lets just say some kid from a D2 school takes 3rd at 99 as an 8th grader , grows a lot is at 113 or even 120 and bumps up in a dual tournament the next season so maybe all the way up at 126 now and takes on a senior who cut down from 130’s who is maybe just a D1 state qualifier and he just physically dominates the kid and gets the win, and picks up huge points in the process, what 90 points ?
i dont know how you fix something like that, other than giving kids less points overall for beating state place finishers, give big points for placing, less for beatings (someone mentioned that above too) you can have an excellent season and only pick up maybe 150-200 points, and on one day maybe get lucky, catch a kid with a craddle or a throw, or run into a situation like i stated above and pick up say 50+ points, i dont know man
Alex,
Just go out and beat the field. No slams!
Can Divisionals be done away with, in place have a two weekend sectional meet?
[...] the topics up for discussion are the seeds for both Division 1 and Division 2, my latest team Power Rankings, and how things may shake out at sectionals. Come [...]
Does the seeding really matter? All the wrestler each person is talking about has to do is win. Then where they were placed or seeded will not really matter. Now if you doubt in your own mind that your wrestler can win…..then the seeding is probably correct. and everyone is upset about the facts. So just tell your wrestler to win and mistakes or not will no longer matter.
If you are counting on a wildcard…then you and your wrestler are not really focused on doing what it takes to win.
Can’t wait for the wrestling to begin
cya
Superduck,
What happened to 145?
coach warren
“what if the win against 3rd in state was at easterns??”
I’m sorry but beating a 3rd place guy is not the same as placing 3rd much less 2nd.
“If i lose to a 4th place guy in d1 I get 2 pts, i actually lose pts by wrestling him than sitting on my butt and not wrestling that day.”
I’m not sure what you are saying hear??
“Beating a sec champ is worth 50 pts. beating a 5th is worth 20”
I can’t disagree more. The drop off from 1st to 5th in most sections is huge. Most Section champs would pin or tech the 5th place finisher.
“You recieve no points for regular season tournament places. So placing high above other kids means nothing.”
Your point? I know this. My point is you get more points for winning Divisions than you do for winning eastern States. Some Division winners go 2 and out at Sections and some weights at Divisionals only had 2 wrestlers this year.
“There is a difference in points between beating d1 and d2 kids”
I said i was not sure of this. Does anyone know the difference?
“If your not 100% sure on exact details, Dont come on here making up false numbers to get people more fired up.”
Calm your Jets! The only thing I wasn’t sure of I mentioned so. Also, we are all entitled to our opinions and I highly doubt you are 100% sure of anything nor am I.
Have fun at Sectionals!
I was stating a fact. Beating a section champ IS worth 50, beating a 5th place guy is worth 20. You said 30 for sec champ.
If im 24-0 and sit a match vs a kid who was 4th in section my record pts are 100, If i wrestle the 4th in section and lose my record is 24-1 for 96 record pts, and i get 2 pts for losing to that kid for a total of 98pts. So my points would be higher by dodging the kid, so getting pts for losses is actually fair.
You get more pts for winning divisionals than e.states because not everyone can get into easterns. The waiting list is 125 teams deep, is it fair to kids who cant get in? Everyone wrestles in divisionals and it adds some prestige to winning divisionals.
@Jap
“Your point? I know this. My point is you get more points for winning Divisions than you do for winning eastern States. Some Division winners go 2 and out at Sections and some weights at Divisionals only had 2 wrestlers this year.”
The point of wrestling in tough tournaments like Eastern States is for competition points, some kids can muster up 100+ points from quality wins like in Feniger’s case.
“I said i was not sure of this. Does anyone know the difference?”
At the state level there is no difference in points but at the sectional level there is.
WIN AGAINST
Place | D1 | D2 |
1st | 50 | 30 |
2nd | 40 | 20 |
3rd | 35 | 10 |
4th | 30 | 6 |
5th | 20 | 4 |
6th | 15 | 0 |
_
I’ll clear up 145 in a moment
Mastro:
Record:
(37/39)*100 = 95pts
Prestige:
Division Champion 2011: 10pts
Division Champion 2012: 15pts
Caliber of Competition:
Morse, IanRondout Valley Sr HS 145 W DEC 4 – 3 (3rd Section 9: 35pts)
Santos, AngelArlington High School 145 W MD 10 – 0 (6th Section 1: 15pts)
Marvin, BradRoy C Ketcham Sr HS 152 W DEC 14 – 6(6th Section 1: 15pts)
Solis, EdgarWestlake High School 152 W MD 12 – 2 (1st Section 1: 30pts)
White, DaleJohn Jay Sr – EF HS 152 L FALL 1:52 (3rd Section 1: 3pts)
Pecora, ChrisCarmel Sr High School 145 W MD 12 – 4 (3rd Section 1: 35pts)
Bachmeier, Max Mahopac High School 145 W MD 16 – 6 (4th Section 1: 30pts)
Artrip, Andrew Suffern Sr HS 145 W DEC 3 – 0 (6th Section 1: 15pts)
Voelker, Andrew Monroe Woodbury 145 W TF 18 – 2 (3rd Section 9: 35pts)
Pecora, ChrisCarmel Sr High School 145 W MD 14 – 2 (3rd Section 1: 35pts)
Morreale, GiancarloFox Lane High School145 W DEC 7 – 1 (5th Section 1: 20pts)
Pecora, ChrisCarmel Sr High School 145 W MD 15 – 4 (3rd Section 1: 35pts)
NET TOTAL: 423pts
Eastern states is a regular season tournament, in terms of seeding criteria. It has no impact what so ever. It is just like the Carlucci or Ketchem duals or Shoreline. Yes it is VERY competitive but again its just another tournament, and as Coach Warren said you can not fault a kid for not being able to get in because the tournament is full.
Mastro has 442.87 points.
Thanks Duck
I’m glad we have this point system in place instead of a blind draw or even the old way from divisional placements.
There were so many instances where one division had 2 or 3, and even 4 occasionally of the top wrestlers in a certain weight. You would end up occasionally with top 4 seeds with losing records as well.
cya
Caputo:
Record:
(40/43)*100= 93pts
Prestige:
3rd Section 1: 30pts
2012 Division Champion: 15pts
Caliber of Competition:
Weston, Chris Pine Bush Sr HS 160 W DEC 9 – 3 (3rd Section 9: 35pts)
Weigel, Austin Onteora Sr HS 160 W DEC 8 – 6 (2nd Section 9: 20pts)
Grippi, Tom Fox Lane High 145 L DEC 7 – 9 (2nd Section 1: 3pts)
Goldup, Brendan La Salle Institute 145 W FALL 5:51 (3rd Section 2: 35pts)
Dickman, Dan Greene High School 145 W DEC 2 – 0 (2nd Section 2: 20pts)
rasheed, Corey Longwood High 145 W DEC 9 – 5 (5th NYS: 80pts)
Kloc, James Iroquois Sr HS 145 L DEC 2 – 5 (NYS CHAMP: 5pts)
Dickman, Dan Greene High School 145 W SV 7 – 5 (2nd Section 2: 20pts)
rasheed, Corey Longwood High 145 L DEC 2 – 7 (5th NYS: 4pts)
Artrip, Andrew Suffern Sr HS 145 W TF16 – 0 (6th Section 1: 15pts)
NET TOTAL: 375pts
I agree that it doesnt make sense that a wrestler recieves 20 points for beating a guy who took 5th in the section. Also I think it would make more sense to adjust the amount of points recieved for beating sectional placers depending on what section they are from. For example, they should have a certain number of points for beating guys who place in the top 4 sections of the state and then a new set for the middle 4 sections and a new set for the bottom 4. This would be similar to the wildcard “Power points.” A system like this could prevent a guy from getting 50 points from defeating a section 11 guy and the same 50 points from defeating a PSAL section champ.
Also I think it is pretty clear that the head to head system is ridiculous. The points really wouldnt matter that much if the head to head system was better.
at 106 notaro the 8th seed beat seligson the 7th seed twice. how does he not take his spot?
Only top 4 seeds can jump
D1 please do not use rational common sense to figure this sysytem. You could beat the kid 3x and still be lower.
1. I agree that the system failed at 113 and 145
2. IT DOES NOT MATTER Unless you are sucking to much weight (in which case you can argue you have an unfair advantage the longer delay btw weigh in and wrestling) and for 2nd and 3rd.
Yes Mastro will be in the finals. But if correct he will come in 2nd and 3rd place could get a wild card.
Grappling- top 6 can jump head to head
1 thru 8th seed.
Large Schools – Coaches will have an opportunity to review each weight class
allowing for challenges 1-4 seeds for the Divisionals and 1-8 seeds for the
Sectionals to see if seeded appropriately or to apply head-to-head criteria.
Head to Head
1. A wrestler will move up one spot if he has a head to head win over the
individual immediately ahead of him, e.g. 4 seed defeats 3, 3 seed defeats 2,
2 seed defeats 1.
2. Head to head consideration will occur working down in this order: 2 seed vs.
1, 3 seed vs. 2, 4 seed vs. 3.
3. Wrestlers are not reordered if head to head did occur and step #3 is
repeated if necessary.
145 isnt as crazy as people make it. Mastro lost to white when white was at 152, and he never wrestled caputo. All three have had great seasons. To say Mastro cannot win in the final is a stretch. I think this weight class is up for grabs. Dont be surprised to see multiple wildcards here either.
Mastro has no chance at a wildcard, he didnt place in sectionals last yr. White and caputo have great chances. As a section 1 fan i would like to see mastro win so we could get 3 kids into states.
No chance? Hes got more points than both white and caputo.. Is that a factor?
Those points are sectional points…do not mean anything at state. It is a different formula, in which previous sectional placing is a huge factor. I know Mastro did not place last year but did he place previously. I do know that Caputo and White have placed multiple times.
Got you! Thanks for the info.
[...] reference, here are the full Division 1 seeds, and the full Division 2 seeds. Now, here are my [...]
Since we are all talking about it – what is the point system for wild card entry.
Basically all 2nd & 3rd place finishers at sectionals are eligible. If 3rd place finisher has more points than #2 they can only get the wild card if they did NOT lose to #2 in the tournament
Point system:
1)Wins-Losses (max 45 points) for current season
2)Bonus points based on prior year sectional & state place finishes (there’s a chart detailing the points)
3)Power points – based on the sections past 6yr history of NYS Tourney placing. ie.. last year Sect 1 Div 1 got 5 points, Sect 1 Div 2 got 5 points
4)Competition Points – 6pts for beating state champ, 5pts for beating NYS #2, 4pts for NYS #3, 3pts for NYS #4, 2pts for NYS #5, 1pt for NYS #6
5)Tie Breaker (in order): Head to Head / State bonus points earned / Sectional bonus points earned / most pins current season / most tech’s current season / most majors current season / coin flip